Andrea Macdonald: [00:08:33] Bioquark has been
going for 11 years now I believe. Could you take us through the
main successes so far?
Ira Pastor: [00:08:51] Absolutely! The first
couple years was spent virtually as a tech company spin off from a
university in South Florida. After that we transitioned into our
own laboratories and the core focus of what we're doing is to
leverage research that has been around for the past 80 years. In
fact, Dr John Gurdon over in the UK recently got the Nobel Prize in
2012 for this understanding of how time is turned back in cells,
tissues and organs in the natural world. Bioquark covered by The
Daily Telegraph: How Dead could be brought back to life.
[00:09:32] We want to elevate this research to the next phase and
basically how we could take those same dynamics, understand what's
been done over the past 80 years in the petri dish, and leverage it
for therapeutic purposes, because underlying much of what we see in
the case of regeneration or disease reversion or age reversal is
this ability to turn back biologic time and start over. So, the
first couple years after our establishing our own independent lab,
we spent a lot of time in the petri dish and in vitro systems
recapitulating a lot of what was done in the last 80 years by
people like Gurdon etc. Following that we have developed a rather
robust in vivo system in house, for the study in animals, rodents,
mice, rats, guinea pigs, rabbits and cats and how we apply some of
this in the pre-clinical non-human sense. [00:10:33] So, we have
studies in oncology, cancer development and cancer reversion.
Studying regeneration specifically, we have a focus on the central
nervous system, especially following acute damage. Also, we are
studying long term gerontological models to understand what is
involved in the aging process over the lifetime of a species and
what happens at different intervals as that age can be shoved back
or turned back to earlier points. Now, we are at an interesting
inflection point because we are a US company. We have a U.S. plan
for clinical development which comes online in the next three years
under traditional guidance. But at the same point beyond our
borders here in the U.S. we are very active right now in studying
abroad the two hundred plus regulatory systems out there because in
today's day and age in 2018 we truly have a globalized system of
medical research and drug development. So, we're also out there
around the globe looking at different regulatory systems trying to
figure out where we can get into human studies, where we can get
registration possibly a few years in advance of the US system to
become more of a global development company because at the end of
the day while the industry ignored the rest of the world in the
past you can do that anymore. Really smart people will tell you
that if you're not looking elsewhere, you're going to be missing a
big picture in the next 10, 20, 30 years as the system and industry
develops. Bioquark in the New York
Post: How stem cell therapy will attempt to bring the dead back to
life. [00:12:05] So, this is in essence sort of our path and
what we've been involved in doing as we sort of formalize our
strategy and mission.
Andrea Macdonald: [00:12:14] How far do you think
that you are in bringing any of these products to market?
Ira Pastor: [00:12:21] Well, as I mentioned in the
U.S. we have a plan to get to registration for an orphan fast track
designation within the next 5 years. However, at the same time we
are beyond a pharmaceutical company and pharmaceutical development.
We are also very active in non-Rx development. So, we will be
bringing products to market within the next few months with
cosmetic partners, with nutritional product partners in different
countries around the world. So, we have both short term and
long-term plans in our strategy. Andrea Macdonald:
[00:13:01] Are you able to talk about the specifics at this point?
[00:13:09] You say that you're working with some organisations to
bring some of these things to market or elements of them to market
in the next few months. Are you able to name any names? Ira
Pastor: [00:13:22] Well, I can't give you specific names
at this point in time. But we have partners specifically in the
Netherlands that are going to be bringing a line of cosmetic
products online which we will be disclosing shortly and we are
partnered up with a group in Southeast Asia in Thailand that is
also involved in the cosmetic and nutritional side of the business.
[00:13:46] We will be doing more public disclosure of these things
but they are primarily on the non-Rx side of the business at the
moment.
Andrea Macdonald: [00:14:02] You're doing quite a
big media push at the moment. I was just wondering what the key
objective in doing that is? Ira Pastor: [00:14:12]
The objective is in essence to raise awareness of the whole space.
I come out of the pharmaceutical industry and I spent you know the
last 30 years in one facet or another of this system and you know
too often in talking to people the bio life sciences space is seen
as evil, or boring or always promising things that are 30 years
out. [00:14:34] I want to get the message out that is not always
the case. We're at a very interesting inflection point in regard to
addressing some of the most dreaded diseases responsible for our
suffering and death. The last hundred years has seen an amazing
expansion in treatment potential from this industry. But when it
comes to cures for any of the chronic degenerative diseases that
are responsible for our death we have not. [00:15:24] So, want to
get the message out there that there is a secondary industry that
is developing here. When I look the traditional pharmaceutical
industry more as a treatment centrice, that there will
be and there is a secondary industry developing that is going to be
much more focused on eliminating disease and turning it back
reverting it, curing as opposed to just treating. So, that's sort
of the mission of getting the message out there. Also wanting to
generatel excitement especially within the young
community in this area I think you know. Too often when we think
about technology nowadays, we think of those little apps on our
phones. Gratification is immediate in that technology space.
[00:16:09] I wanted to reiterate the fact that bio tech and life
sciences technology is exciting. And there's a lot of activity.
There's a lot of activity and things are going to be coming fast
and furious in the coming years which is really going to shake
things up. Andrea Macdonald: [00:16:35] Can you
talk to us about ReAnima? Ira Pastor:
[00:16:36] Absolutely. ReAnima is a project of ours which was
specifically set up to address what we felt was a very underserved
area of the bio sciences, namely the severe disorders of
consciousness. And whether that be persistent vegetative state, or
coma or the end of the disorders of consciousness spectrum, which
is brain death. How we could begin to connect a lot of what we are
learning in the area of regenerative medicine and central nervous
system regeneration, what we're learning in the area of cognitive
neurosciences and what we have known as a legitimate ethical
research niche of living cadaver research which has been going on
for the last 30 years and how we can blend this all together for
some really important insights. To touch on an area that maybe
unpalatable to some but it is something that we have defined and
understood since 1968 as the definition of death around the world
and an irreversible condition. But in the year 2018, half a century
later, this area which we haven't been willing to explore as a
species, at Bioquark we think that it is a legitimate area of
exploration and one that will have a tremendous amount of
trickle-down effect on all of the chronic degenerative diseases of
the central nervous system, beyond just obviously addressing the
issue of what life means and what death means. So, it is not core
but it is definitely something that we are very interested in
actively in pursuing and it is part of our program. Andrea
Macdonald: [00:18:21] Would you like to live forever?
Ira Pastor: [00:18:25] I would like to live in a
healthy state for a much longer period of time than evolution and
natural selection have granted. So, if one takes into account that
on average humans are given by the forces thate be
around 75 years of life span, a fraction of that which is in truly
exceptional health and health span. Sure, I would love to. I would
love to see the future to go beyond what evolution has granted us
in and see a bit of the future. Does that mean I want to live
substantially longer in terms of thousand-year life spans? Ah,
we'll talk about that when we start breaking through some of the
barriers but sure would love to have the opportunity to make ninety
the new thirty and be able to live vibrant life for much longer
than is currently possible. Andrea Macdonald:
[00:19:30] Vigne Kozacek, founder of The Innovation Squad has sent in a question
for you. His concern is, if we live for hundreds of years, if we
become maybe immortal, what sort of impact will that have on
population and the resources? Ira Pastor:
[00:19:30] It is a great question. Clearly, if one succeeds in
solving this. Well, there's two parts to the immortality equation.
You must solve aging. You must solve death. And clearly, although
people will debate it, if over population of is a death
rate or birth rate issue and so forth, clearly if you no longer die
and you slow the aging process there are some fundamental issues
that will have to be addressed as a society. I point out that if we
are capable of doing both of these things in terms of biologic
aging and death reversal, then we should be able to address as a
society any problem, whether that is energy production, whether
that is abundant agriculture, whether that is geo engineering,
environmental engineering, appropriate stewardship of many of the
resources that we take for granted. Things will undoubtedly have to
change. But we do not believe that they will be insurmountable, by
any means. Andrea Macdonald: [00:21:26] Stephen
Cave, who wrote the book Immortality and is the executive director
and head of research at the Leverholme Institute believes that
there is a possibility of making the benefits of the AI accessible
to everyone but the scale of it. How will it be managed? [00:22:02]
I mean, you've just said that a humanity that is able to achieve X
Y Z will achieve the scaling problem but we have these huge
imbalances in society now. I don't really like the terms third and
fourth world but are those things, those extremes not going to be
exaggerated in the new world that we create? Ira
Pastor: [00:22:38] I believe that if we create them
intelligently there will not be the issue that is predicted. When I
say this, I mean in the context of, if we are intelligent about the
way we ultimately develop such innovations in this particular space
in terms of biology and the life sciences whether it be,
penicillin, aspirin, the opiates, quinine and so forth, they
happened over a hundred years ago and when one looks at the history
of true innovations and their respective costs over time, how much
real improvement over the original improvement have been made? It
is fairly slim and so I know people will point out you know these
million-dollar gene therapies and other ridiculously priced forms
of tissue engineering and all sort of other possibilities that are
coming down the line. But I point out that if we do things
intelligently. I don't want to promote my company too much but our
company is taking a 20th Century approach to dealing with some of
these issues and implementing them as opposed to a much more
radical 21st Century approach. I believe the ability to have
everyone at the table in participating, usinge and
utilising these tools. It will not be the case of creating two
societies. Obviously, as a human society we will need to deal with
some of the bigger issues. I have faith in humanity that if we can
get over this hurdle, there’s no hurdle we can't get over. We
should be able to solve the rest. Andrea
Macdonald: [00:25:25] Yuval Noah Harari, in his book The
Homo Deus says that we have no idea how these exponential
technologies are going to interact with each other we don't know
what the progress in nano tech for example will be affected by the
progress in quantum physics. Are we doing enough to put legislation
in place, policing in place to ensure that things properly? You
mentioned that your company is taking a 20th (correction from
audio) Century approach to the way you operate it doesn't therefore
follow that all other organisations within exponential technology
behave as well as yours. In his book Technology versus Humanity
Gerd Leonhard puts a case for establishing a committee, group of
people for want of a better word who will monitor this progress,
who will ensure that not only as many people as possible benefit
but that something terrible does not arise out of it. What's your
opinion, should we be doing more to establish a framework in which
this progress operates? Ira Pastor: [00:27:10]
Absolutely. I think that we are behind in regard to this. I can't
speak too much about artificial intelligence or quantum computing
or some of the other mind-blowing possibilities but I can speak
about biology and life sciences and don't think that anything has
been done and clearly because no one until recently has even
believed that some of this is possible. It is just been the very
nature of the biotech biopharma system. Life extension and
immortality that is not coming for a long time. Well maybe that's
not the case. So, obviously we have to do a lot more from a
perspective of legislation and oversight and international bodies
that can spend time on really coming up with the plans and big
picture discussions for an inevitable post human world, as some
like to describe it, that is coming rather rapidly. [00:28:33] We
spend time discussing this in the human enhancement group at The
World Economic Forum and debating and discussing some of these
topics. But yes, we have a tremendous amount of ducks to get in a
row, whether it is our fear of biology, or AI or quantum computing
or any of these other really unique topics. Many people we have
fallen decades behind in drug development. We haven't fallen
decades behind in these new areas because they haven't existed
before. We have a lot of catch up to do on many fronts. It might
have to happen more a more exponential pace than we anticipate.
There is not a day that goes by that some very unique discovery is
not made in some of these related fields. Andrea
Macdonald: [00:29:56] You are a pharmacist. Which other
scientists are you working with? Ira Pastor:
[00:29:57] We all work with a variety of different individuals
around the world, with a rather broad spectrum of capabilities. We
work with embryology, with clinical medicine folks, neurology. We
have partnered at one point with someone insPharmaco
epidemiology . Yes, the full spectrum. The concept of reversion of
biologic reversion in nature requires a lot more than this
traditional pharmacological thinking in regard to biologic moieties
that impact genomic outputs. When it comes to some of the things
that are involved in regeneration, repair and reversion it goes
beyond the traditional tools involved. So, embryology doesn't
typically show up in the pharmaceutical industry very much but
embryology and historical embryology how we have studied the
reversal of time not just in organisms both human and not, not just
the reversion process of regulatory states of tissues themselves
but also the regeneration process because they are intricately
connected, whether we are talking about restarting time in an
embryo or a limb. So, we have been rather broad in bringing all
thoughts to the table. It is a multi-disciplinary approach.
Andrea Macdonald: [00:32:22] You mentioned in one
of your talks recently that pharmaceutical company, Merck have
teamed with the Chinese government to establish an island where
cancer patients can go to try out, trial drugs which have not come
to market yet. And this is presumably that certainly sounds quite
forward thinking. What is your reaction to how the pharmaceutical
companies are addressing the big health issues? Ira
Pastor: [00:33:04] Well, my core reaction to how we
address big health issues is, technically I am not in big pharma
anymore but I spent enough time there, they address the big health
issues horribly. The model is one of addressing the genomic output,
so the symptoms of disease as opposed the upstream biologic factors
that cause disease. That being said what Merck recently did
addresses something that is quite crucial to people which is
expanded access. People have realised the amazing clinical gap
around the world. In other words, the millions of patients that
have no option. No ability to access clinical trials and expanded
access programs in various countries. [00:34:13] A very small
percentage of patients, in cancer for example, less than 5 percent
of anyone dying of cancer who has gone through the window of
existing treatment even seeks out a clinical trial in the world
today which is insanity in its own right. So this area that we've
briefly mentioned in relation to the globalisation of medical
training and medical research nowadays which was once seen as niche
in terms of medical tourism and pharmaceutical tourism when you
have the fifth largest pharmaceutical company world teaming up with
the largest country in the world to do something creative like this
you realizse that times are changing. [00:34:56] On can
only look at Harvard Medical School operating in Dubai, Cornell
operating in Qatar and Newcastle University operating in Malaysia
to realizse that this is becoming a globalized system.
So, I think it’s a pretty good thing. Andrea
Macdonald: [00:35:43] Ron Gelman, Counselor has sent in a
number of comments, one of which was, "Can we really deny people
progress, even if initially an elite group gain the benefits of
that progress? As with any progress in the last hundred years it
always starts with an elite few having access to it and as prices
drop more people will have access to that so-called progress." This
brings to mind another question that ideaXme want to ask in these
interviews which evaluate the impact of exponential technology.
"How will this impact our rights as humans. A, if we deny people
progress and B if we only offer it to an elite few initially?"
Ira Pastor: [00:37:00] I can't speak for everyone,
but it is within our strategy to make what we do available to
anyone around the globe to any healthcare system around the globe.
That's why we've focused on traditional biologic development as
opposed to the next generation million dollar a shot possibility.
So, we clearly understand that we do not want to create a
two-tiered society. Ira Pastor: [00:37:19] I can't
speak for the potential of AI or other stuff that is coming but in
terms of biology and biotech, I think that there are ways if we're
intelligent and we do things the right way to address that but as
far as our human race absolutely and you know we discussed offline
the issues of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, including
Article three the Right to Life and that is something that clearly
violates that. Ira Pastor: [00:38:06] Article 5
says that no one shall be subjected to cruel or degrading treatment
but I think that everyone who has had a loved go through cancer
therapy through todays system realises that is not always the case.
Ira Pastor: [00:38:15] We have U.N. Rights in
Article 13 to move freely but in people with a spinal cord injury
or multiple sclerosis or other forms of paralysis, that right is
violated. Ira Pastor: [00:38:27] In Article 16 we
have the right to start a family but in cases of biologic,
pathologic or age-related infertility, that is not the case.
[00:39:08] Now, clearly there are some rights in terms of the
international order and social systems that we owe a debt to. But
once again, I believe that these are manageable if we do things
right. Andrea Macdonald: [00:39:30] Are you a
religious man? Ira Pastor: [00:39:33] I am glad
you brought it up because usually people think that anyone
operating in the area of ageing or death has to be an atheist. I am
not an atheist. I was raised as a Conservative Jew. I am a reformed
Jew now. I consider myself a fairly spiritual person. I am not
involved in any of this because of a fear of death, or what comes
next. [00:40:16] Just as Article 18 in the United Nations Bill of
Human Rights, it clearly states the ability to practice religion
and change religion based on our understanding. Religion is all
about seeking truth. And I think too often religion and science
have been diametrically opposed to one another by actually I
believe that science and religion brought together in the right way
can support each other very nicely in a lot of these areas and
whether that's looking beyond the curtain of death, or sort of
understanding this unfolding space that we're seeing in terms of
non-central nervous system information storage and consciousness.
There is so much to learn that could benefit each segment, I think.
Andrea Macdonald: [00:41:14] What sparked your
interest in biotech? What set you along that path? Ira
Pastor: [00:41:24] Well several things. My love of science
fiction and comic books and wanting to create the future from a
very young age. Also, I watched my father die of spinal cancer. As
a young child, I watched my maternal grandfather die of heart
disease. I watched my mother die of lung disease. Ira
Pastor: [00:41:59] I put this together, with having hung
out in a trillion-dollar industry which has been unable in the year
2018 to address any of the chronic diseases responsible for my
loved ones degeneration and death. Andrea
Macdonald: [00:42:17] Are you looking for investment in
your organization? Ira Pastor: [00:42:22] We are a
biotech company at our core. The old joke goes if you are not
raising money constantly, you are not doing your job correctly. So,
yes, we're always raising money. Andrea Macdonald:
[00:42:35] Are you looking for collaborators and/or employees?
Ira Pastor: [00:42:45] Collaborators always, we
are constantly on the lookout suitable companies, hospitals, fast
moving consumer goods companies. We partner with everyone and
anyone who shares our vision in mind. Employees? Not at the moment.
Andrea Macdonald: [00:43:11] Out of everyone
within the biotech industry, who would you most like to work with?
Have you had trouble getting in front of a particular organization
or person that you would like to get in front of? Ira
Pastor: [00:43:23] Having 30 years in the Pharma industry
I am pretty good at getting in front of people. Getting in front of
the right investors is always a tough thing. Sure, I'd like to sit
in front of Bill Gates or Warren Buffett and give them a thirty
second elevator pitch. Andrea Macdonald:
[00:44:09] Out of everyone you could meet in the world who would
you most like to meet and what question would you like to ask that
person? Ira Pastor: [00:44:40] There are several
people on that list but I would have to say I would love to spend
some time with Thomas Edison. I see people in this industry who
have one failure and they pack up. I would love to have gone back
and talk to Edison right at the middle point. I would love to ask
him, "What keeps you going?" Andrea Macdonald:
[00:46:12] In your opinion, which is the most authoritative book on
exponential technology. Ira Pastor: [00:46:35] I
am a big fan of the future but I find the past much more exciting.
A book that I recommend to everyone actually comes from the 1970's
and is called Shuffle Brain and it has to do
with research that was going on at the University of Indiana on
brain removal and brain transplantation. These are topics that are
talked about as futuristic today but they actually happened in the
1970's. Too much of what we have forgotten has the clues in my
opinion to address many of the problems and too often scientific
research is buried or for some reason or another does not see the
light of day. Andrea Macdonald [00:48:06] To all
those future creators or people considering taking the plunge. A
few words of wisdom, your recommendation about what to do next. If
they're teetering on the edge shall I, shan't I? Am I brave enough?
The world is watching. Dare I make the plunge? What would you say
to them. Ira Pastor: [00:48:31] I would say don't
get involved in the space unless you can deal with rejection,
failure and the realisation that all of this, whether it is
biology, whether it is information technology, whether it is the
new concepts, it is going to take time. It didn't happen overnight
for the innovators who succeeded in the nineteenth century. It is
going to take time. If you have tough skin, you don't worry about
what people think about you or say, come on get involved!
Andrea Macdonald: [00:55:43] Ira Pastor, CEO
Bioquark, thank you very much for your time! Ira
Pastor: [00:55:43] My pleasure. This interview will
shortly be available in audio format on the ideaXme iTunes and
Soundcloud channels. This article will be also re-published on our
blog. Follow @IraSamuelPastor
@ideaxm